Why your sleep study night will be an awful night of sleep

[nanwilson]

Hmm, in light of the huge increase in the prescription of antidepressants, maybe folks aren't doing enough complaining due to the perception that having negative feelings isn't acceptable. Anyway, I am kind of tired of the "attitude police" on this board telling people how much they can complain or can't. You have no idea what is going on in our lives and to make judgments about what can be said or not is extremely outrageous. Enough said.

49er

Its a hell of a lot easier to complain about it than take the bull by the horns and do it, isn't it. No, we don't know what is going on in other peoples lives... do you not think there is terrible stuff going on in our lives too. Yes, its much easier to complain than getting down and doing something that you think is abhorrent, but once you stop complaining and get the job done you become much stronger and can face other hurdles down the road. Complaints do not fix things, doing something about it fixes it. The subject line of this thread reads "Why your sleep study night will be an awful night"; yes it will, unless something changes to make it better, or find a different way to get it done .... just talking or complaining about it will not get it changed.

[49er]

Hmm, in light of the huge increase in the prescription of antidepressants, maybe folks aren't doing enough complaining due to the perception that having negative feelings isn't acceptable. Anyway, I am kind of tired of the "attitude police" on this board telling people how much they can complain or can't. You have no idea what is going on in our lives and to make judgments about what can be said or not is extremely outrageous. Enough said.

49er

Its a hell of a lot easier to complain about it than take the bull by the horns and do it, isn't it. No, we don't know what is going on in other peoples lives... do you not think there is terrible stuff going on in our lives too. Yes, its much easier to complain than getting down and doing something that you think is abhorrent, but once you stop complaining and get the job done you become much stronger and can face other hurdles down the road. Complaints do not fix things, doing something about it fixes it. The subject line of this thread reads "Why your sleep study night will be an awful night"; yes it will, unless something changes to make it better, or find a different way to get it done .... just talking or complaining about it will not get it changed.

Nan,

You have some good points but what makes you think that people who complain aren't taking the bull by the horns to do something about their situation? Or maybe they seem like whiners in one area but take the bull by the horn in others.

Now I have been in other situations on forums where one poster will complain about the same issue repeatedly and yes, that does get annoying. But I didn't see that in this thread but I realize people view things differently.

49er

[mollete]

Try going to the bathroom... If you're a guy and remain standing throughout the entire performance, you'll have to do everything one-handed...

Well, for most guys, that's usually quite sufficient.

If you need more than one hand, I imagine you're pretty popular with the ladies.

[Todzo]

We absolutely need a much better implementation of the Polysomnogram and it's use in xPAP titration. In lab, uncomfortable, super expensive, one shot testing is resulting in way too many going without proper diagnosis and treatment.

We need to see the medical community gird up their own loins, become forthright in their dealings, and get down to the business of actually healing our diseases. If they cannot do that we need to replace them.

[SeekSleep]

Fortunately, I didn't realize the sleep study would be terrible, so I actually ended up sleeping better than normal through my first two studies.

I'd had sleep apnea for 35 plus years, quite severe, so lack of sleep was the norm for me when I went in for my study. I was hooked up and ready to go by 10 pm, and it took less than 10 minutes for me to fall asleep despite the wires as I was exhausted. A couple hours later, they did wake me up to slap a mask on me and I was asleep again in under 10 minutes. They didn't wake me up till 6am. For work I have to get up normally at 4:15 so sleeping in was sweet. Unfortunately, with the cpap titration they only got me down to mid 30's AHI because of centrals, with o2 levels no better than 80's so I had to come back another night.

Second sleep study, again fell asleep in less than 10 minutes, woke up once during the night, had the tech wake me up at 6am, and felt better than I could remember feeling in a long time. This despite only having an AHI slightly over 10 as the best they could do.

Third study with the ASV titration was a little rough, partially because I had the tech try me on a different mask than I became used to with my home bipap trial, and partially because I was no longer so tired I could sleep through anything. Other than trashing my nose though with the new mask which I cranked down to tight, I really can't say the night was awful though. I've had a lot of worse nights in the last few months alone. So far, the titration studies and resulting treatment had been a blessing, although there is still room for improvement which hopefully the ASV machine my DME has on order for me will take care of.

[gburcalow]

That sounded just like my first time at the lab! I had already done a home study, they knew I needed CPAP, but could not determine the correct setting. After 3 months on CPAP, they still do not have it, but I have been monitoring my data and it looks like I am falling between 8 and 11 on average. It is definitely working.

The tech in the lab was nice, let me try all the masks, and was very understanding. I even took a prescribed sedative and was wide awake most of the night!

[jdm2857]

We absolutely need a much better implementation of the Polysomnogram and it's use in xPAP titration. In lab, uncomfortable, super expensive, one shot testing is resulting in way too many going without proper diagnosis and treatment.

Will someone please adjust the forum reverb dial?

The echo is back.

[jdm2857]

I wonder if you'd consider changing the title of your note so it won't put off newbies before they even get started.

I'd certainly consider changing it to something a less absolute: "could be" or "might be" instead of "will be".

How about "Why my sleep study night was an awful night of sleep"?

[chunkyfrog]

But no matter how unpleasant a sleep study is; it may very well SAVE YOUR LIFE!
Like a colonoscopy, a pap test, or a prostate exam, the "down side" is more than balanced out by the "up side"-
--you get to live longer; which is generally a good thing, unless you are one of those people who manage to annoy people;
then it may not be so good for them. (edit)

[Todzo]

If the sleep testing were:

In the native environment of the person so that the test would actually represent a true picture of how the person normally sleeps

Were done over several nights since no one sleeps the same any two nights, weeks …

Were made to be much less intrusive in terms of comfort and fit

Of much more reasonable cost

Then many more lives, jobs, marriages, support for children, basic health, and economic prosperity would be saved.

Right now I think the sleep medicine community is it's own worst enemy. As they diagnose and treat disease we all know that they very often fail. Each failure creates a dissatisfied customer and too many of those will kill any business. And we all suffer. We are placed in danger on our roads. Our lives are at stake. Our jobs. Our marriages. The support of our children. Our basic health. The health of our economy and our future.

Rather than girding up their own loins and dealing forthrightly to change what is not working they blame the people they are supposed to be serving for what is indeed their own failure to deal with the problems in the way they do business.

Well shame on them for all of that. Let us see the sleep medicine community change that. And if they will not then let us see that others get the opportunity to do what they apparently cannot.

[49er]

Todzo,

A sleep study over several nights to diagnose apnea is totally unnecessary and a waste of money. And in borderline cases, many physicians will prescribe a pap machine to see if the person improves.

Getting an effective titration is another issue. Some people have had a great experience and others have not. Obviously, something needs to be done but in my opinion, as I have previously mentioned, your ideas would be extremely expensive and time consuming, and as a result, not feasible in my opinion.

49er

If the sleep testing were:

In the native environment of the person so that the test would actually represent a true picture of how the person normally sleeps

Were done over several nights since no one sleeps the same any two nights, weeks …

Were made to be much less intrusive in terms of comfort and fit

Of much more reasonable cost

Then many more lives, jobs, marriages, support for children, basic health, and economic prosperity would be saved.

Right now I think the sleep medicine community is it's own worst enemy. As they diagnose and treat disease we all know that they very often fail. Each failure creates a dissatisfied customer and too many of those will kill any business. And we all suffer. We are placed in danger on our roads. Our lives are at stake. Our jobs. Our marriages. The support of our children. Our basic health. The health of our economy and our future.

Rather than girding up their own loins and dealing forthrightly to change what is not working they blame the people they are supposed to be serving for what is indeed their own failure to deal with the problems in the way they do business.

Well shame on them for all of that. Let us see the sleep medicine community change that. And if they will not then let us see that others get the opportunity to do what they apparently cannot.

[Todzo]

Thank you for the response 49er,

What I believe you lack here is an understanding of and vision of how technology can be leveraged to solve these problems. I hope you and many others catch this vision soon. The lives and prosperity of many depend upon that!!

It will take an interdisciplinary team approach to do this. Is the sleep medicine community up to that? They need to be! If not lets replace them!

I disagree with you concerning the need for multiple night studies to diagnose. First night effect is well documented. As well I have noted by looking at my own data for several years now that the tendency to obstruct or loose breathing stability can be a sporadic thing albeit often cyclical in character.

I believe that what happens in the lab is unique to the lab. It is what happens in the home that makes or breaks the person's health. We need to change how we test, titrate, and monitor the treatment of Obstructive Sleep Apnea and for the sakes of very many. We need to gird up our loins and get the job done soon. Those unwilling to help need to be gotten out of the way.

The extremely low performance of the current sleep medicine community drives people away from diagnosis and treatment. So lets make sure that the performance levels rise. Peoples lives and prosperity depend upon that!!

Todzo

Todzo,

A sleep study over several nights to diagnose apnea is totally unnecessary and a waste of money. And in borderline cases, many physicians will prescribe a pap machine to see if the person improves.

Getting an effective titration is another issue. Some people have had a great experience and others have not. Obviously, something needs to be done but in my opinion, as I have previously mentioned, your ideas would be extremely expensive and time consuming, and as a result, not feasible in my opinion.

49er

If the sleep testing were:

In the native environment of the person so that the test would actually represent a true picture of how the person normally sleeps

Were done over several nights since no one sleeps the same any two nights, weeks …

Were made to be much less intrusive in terms of comfort and fit

Of much more reasonable cost

Then many more lives, jobs, marriages, support for children, basic health, and economic prosperity would be saved.

Right now I think the sleep medicine community is it's own worst enemy. As they diagnose and treat disease we all know that they very often fail. Each failure creates a dissatisfied customer and too many of those will kill any business. And we all suffer. We are placed in danger on our roads. Our lives are at stake. Our jobs. Our marriages. The support of our children. Our basic health. The health of our economy and our future.

Rather than girding up their own loins and dealing forthrightly to change what is not working they blame the people they are supposed to be serving for what is indeed their own failure to deal with the problems in the way they do business.

Well shame on them for all of that. Let us see the sleep medicine community change that. And if they will not then let us see that others get the opportunity to do what they apparently cannot.

[Todzo]

It has taken at least a thousand years for computer technology to come to where it is. Development became notable about a hundred years ago and has been intense since about fifty years ago. So Amazon took what probably amounts to a couple of trillion dollars of man hours and materials used over that 1000 years and placed a little tablet in my hand that “does most everything pretty well” for under $200 dollars.

Yes we can make the sleep study effective and affordable. We simply need to make use of the tools that are available and get the job done!