Chris8243 Therapy Thread

[Chris8243]

Wondering if someone can look at my Sleepyhead data and offer advice?

Last night I didn't fall asleep until after the first break, around 10 pm, so ignore the beginning. I woke and fussed for a while with mask leaks before giving up and removing it. Crappy night overall after the first few hours of sleep. Felt terrible in the morning.

Can you tell anything about my sleep quality? Looks like a nice, even clean graph, so maybe it is "just" insomnia? Can you tell if there is REM?

[palerider]

It looks like a nice even night, if you turn off the first session (click down on the bottom of the left panel and turn off the session you said to ignore) the numbers would be good... and it was very even... boring, unremarkable, just like it's best to have.

[Chris8243]

Thanks for responding Palerider. I guess my fight is with my mask more than the sleep apnea right now. Ughhh. Been an issue for 2-3 months, can hardly stay asleep all night unless I take an ambien. I know it's not the best but when I'm tired and I really want to sleep, I'll take it.

On my computer I clicked on the session info and see that I can hide sections, thanks for pointing that out. Wondering what is the difference between a yellow vs blue color session, or why is mine in one hour blocks? Does the machine sense turning over or a change in breathing pattern or sleep stage to warrant a new session?

[palerider]

Wondering what is the difference between a yellow vs blue color session, or why is mine in one hour blocks? Does the machine sense turning over or a change in breathing pattern or sleep stage to warrant a new session?

I *think* that the color diff is just to differentiate them better. but I might be mis-remembering that.

A session normally is any time the machine is turned off and on, but sometimes there's a glitch in the data and SH interprets that as a new session.

[Dog Slobber]

I *think* that the color diff is just to differentiate them better. but I might be mis-remembering that.

You're remembering correctly.

The yellow/blue session colour is to differentiate them easier.

Single session - yellow
Two sessions - yellow, blue
Three sessions - yellow, blue, yellow
Four sessions - yellow, blue, yellow, blue

And so on.
De-activated sessions - white

[palerider]

I *think* that the color diff is just to differentiate them better. but I might be mis-remembering that.

You're remembering correctly.

The yellow/blue session colour is to differentiate them easier.

Single session - yellow
Two sessions - yellow, blue
Three sessions - yellow, blue, yellow
Four sessions - yellow, blue, yellow, blue

And so on.
De-activated sessions - white

Thanks for checking that.

[Pugsy]

Unfortunately there is no real 100% accurate way of determining sleep stages like REM with the data the machine gathers.
Some people have said they seen to see a certain breathing pattern consistently enough during the times that we would normally be having REM (assuming of course the sleep cycles are progressing normally) but I haven't been able to spot enough difference consistently to formulate any real associations for myself. What others feel that they can be comfortable with assuming...that's up to them and I won't tell them they are wrong....I just can't confirm that they are correct based on anything I see or have experienced. That's why so much of all this cpap stuff comes with the YMMV sticker.
We can sometimes make educated guesses though...and I go that all the time but the educated guess is based on known history as my starting point.

Example: My OSA is documented worse in REM...per an in lab sleep study...and about 5 times worse in REM in terms of AHI.
When I see the machine increasing the pressure at fairly regular intervals that closely seem to correlate to a time we would expect to be seeing REM...I make an educated guess that I was probably in REM when that happened.
For some people supine sleeping causes a big pressure needs change...my OSA was never particularly worse when I was on back though...REM or not.
Sometimes I might even see some small clusters of events in a time frame where I would expect to see REM...again I can make a fairly educated guess assuming that I slept well enough to have the normal cycle progression.
What happens to me though is I know I don't always have the nice normal progression of cycles because my sleep gets disturbed by something unrelated to sleep apnea and when that happens the normal cycles don't always pick up right where they left off before the awakening. A lot depends on what caused the awakening and how long before I was able to go back to sleep.

I have looked at the breathing rate...flow rate...tidal volumes, etc during the time frames where I assume I was in REM...try as much as I can and I can't see enough difference in anything for me to use as a marker for probable REM. The best I can do is maybe spot awake vs non awake breathing and even then sometimes it's not easy.
What I would need is a real sleep study that showed me awake vs asleep AND the various sleep stages and then I could compare them to some of the data we get from the machine and maybe spot a correlation.
Unfortunately I haven't found anyone who wants to let me experiment in that area and is willing to give me a free and very detailed sleep study.

I don't worry so much about it though....knowing for sure about a certain segment of time being REM or N1 stage...isn't really going to change what I do for my therapy. Might scratch a curiosity itch but that's about it. We can't do anything about it anyway.
I tend to not expend much energy on stuff that is out of my control and I can't do anything about. I have enough problems with my energy being used on important stuff.

[Chris8243]

I welcome feedback & advice please. Sleepyhead screenshots of the past two nights. Both mornings I woke up feeling like crap. Last night I took the mask off around 4 am (apparently) because of the high pressure. I was dreaming that I had a giant piece of cake stuffed in my mouth, in my mask, and I couldn't breathe. Better than dreaming that I couldn't dream because I was drowning!

But I'm so frustrated. It's been 1-1/2 years and I still feel like using CPAP is a burden. Last night the break was because I got up & took an ambien and didn't go right back to bed. I wake up frequently, feeling mask leaks around my mouth or eyes. Rarely do I feel like I had a good night's sleep.

PS - sorry about the pie chart. Couldn't figure out how to get rid of it.

[LSAT]

Something happened between 1:30 and 3:00AM that caused your pressure to max out and lots of events. What do you remember?

[Pugsy]

Any leak that causes us to wake up disturbs our sleep and is unwanted...no matter what the size.
If you are having a lot of fragmented sleep or trouble going back to sleep when you do wake up then you aren't ever going to stand much of a chance of feeling better or more rested. You need to resolve the leak issue if it is waking you up often.

Do you have more nights with AHI 1 to 2 or over 5?

You might want to consider an increase in that minimum pressure to see if it helps with the snores or not. That much snoring could also be impacting sleep quality.

Pie chart removal...Preferences/Appearance tab and remove the check mark for show pie chart...but it's not critical here since we can see the statistics clearly anyway.

Is your OSA worse on your back or during REM sleep? Do you know?

[Chris8243]

Something happened between 1:30 and 3:00AM that caused your pressure to max out and lots of events. What do you remember?

I don't remember anything until I woke up because the air was blowing so hard. I tried to relax and breathe normally but the machine wouldn't calm down. I looked at it, I think the pressure was 16.2

[Chris8243]

Do you have more nights with AHI 1 to 2 or over 5?


Is your OSA worse on your back or during REM sleep? Do you know?

My AHI is usually between 2-3. Rarely over 5 and rarely under 2.

I think OSA is worse on my back, not sure, but I am a side sleeper. I don't know how to tell if I'm in REM except lately I've been remembering some dreams if that means anything.

I was surprised at how much snoring was recorded but that may explain why I sometimes wake with an incredibly dry mouth (in the middle of the night), another thing that disturbs my sleep. I have used Xylitol and put one in my mouth at some point last night. I like Xylitol but it doesn't do wonders for me.

[zonker]

I was surprised at how much snoring was recorded but that may explain why I sometimes wake with an incredibly dry mouth (in the middle of the night), another thing that disturbs my sleep. I have used Xylitol and put one in my mouth at some point last night. I like Xylitol but it doesn't do wonders for me.

wish i had more to contribute. you seem to be going through a bit of hell. i can only hope the experts can help.

i'm just commenting about xylitol. have you tried two lozenges, one on each side of your mouth?

[Chris8243]

i'm just commenting about xylitol. have you tried two lozenges, one on each side of your mouth?

No, but I can try that tonight.

[Chris8243]

This is last night, typical AHI for me. I woke up tired but not feeling terrible. It was a quiet night for OA's but I know my settings are not ideal because I still feel like I'm not sleeping well. At one point I was feeling leaks and I turned the machine off and back on - and it helped. My mask seemed to seal right away and all was good and I fell back to sleep. I can see that was at about 5:15 am (the turn off/on) and sure enough the graph shows leak rate creeping up at that time.

Any feedback from this graph? Increase pressure to 10? Still lots of snoring being recorded, and looking back at my data, that's been going on for some time. My husband says he's not noticing it, I suppose it is muffled by the mask.