Last Night Was First Night

[Iancdub88]

Vilazodone

that med is known as a SSRI med and if you google "SSRI meds and sleep" you will get tons of hits about how it can mess with sleep. Lots of documentation out there. SNRI meds the same thing.
Not to mention the daytime symptoms those meds come with.

I know. I just don't have many other options for depression. If this med doesn't work, I'm going to have to look into TMS or Ketamine.

[Pugsy]

I know. I just don't have many other options for depression. If this med doesn't work, I'm going to have to look into TMS or Ketamine.

I thoroughly understand and I really believe that for some people those types of meds are life savers even with the ugly side effects. This is where "we" have to do the risk vs rewards thing and sometimes those ugly side effects are still preferable to not taking mood meds. Also the "knowing" that so and so could be from medication side effects can help one accept and deal with those side effects in a productive manner. Like while it is very possible that medication side effects are screwing with your sleep and daytime feelings....it still might not be as bad of a screwing as what untreated depression will do to a person.

BUT quitting CPAP just because you aren't sleeping so great isn't really a viable solution either.
You would then be adding untreated OSA to the mix and that for sure is a recipe for disaster in terms of sleep quality.

[Iancdub88]

BUT quitting CPAP just because you aren't sleeping so great isn't really a viable solution either.
You would then be adding untreated OSA to the mix and that for sure is a recipe for disaster in terms of sleep quality.

You are absolutely right. I will keep going. It's bound to get better in one way or another.

On another note, I just had my second follow up call with my sleep doctor at Kaiser. It's embarrassing that it feels like I already know more than she does. I had to explain flow limits to her.

[Iancdub88]

How concerning are these leaks? I think last night was my best sleep yet on the CPAP and I didn't notice them.
https://sleephq.com/public/4825c2d9-b92 ... eae7bb9c5c

[Pugsy]

How concerning are these leaks? I think last night was my best sleep yet on the CPAP and I didn't notice them.
https://sleephq.com/public/4825c2d9-b92 ... eae7bb9c5c

I would kill to have a leak line like that.

They didn't disturb your sleep (which is of paramount importance) so I would totally ignore them.
They are well below any large leak that might impact therapy. I don't bat an eyelash over leaks that rare and that tiny as long as I sleep through them.

Plan on taking the sleeping pill again tonight. I forget.....what sleeping med is it that you were given?

[Iancdub88]

Plan on taking the sleeping pill again tonight. I forget.....what sleeping med is it that you were given?

Unfortunately(or probably fortunately) I can't take it every night. It's Clonazepam and it's actually a controlled substance so it can be habit forming and lead to some scary side effects. My doctor was clear that I should take it pretty sparingly. He initially prescribed Trazadone but that clogged my nose up really bad.

I'm thinking about picking up some Melatonin or something over the counter. If anyone has any suggestions on that I would appreciate it.

[Pugsy]

Melatonin isn't without some ugly side effects as well. Research it.

Besides....melatonin is more for falling asleep and not staying asleep.

[Iancdub88]

Melatonin isn't without some ugly side effects as well. Research it.

Besides....melatonin is more for falling asleep and not staying asleep.

Can I ask what you take?

[Pugsy]

Melatonin isn't without some ugly side effects as well. Research it.

Besides....melatonin is more for falling asleep and not staying asleep.

Can I ask what you take?

Give me a bit and I will share what I take. I have to decide if I want to make it public or private.

[TCLynx]

I know you probably won't believe this but I can talk, blow raspberries, yawn or whatever with my mouth open but no air exits the mouth because I can block the back door so that no air pressure even enters the mouth at all so no chance of chipmunk cheeks. It's a reflex action similar to when you blow up a balloon no air tries to exit through the nose.
I can't explain what I do though. It's a reflex.

Can you pass this power onto me?

I'm not sure how Pugsy does it but try sealing your tongue to the roof of your mouth. Pressing your tongue into the roof of your mouth will generally help you keep your mouth shut and probably help keep your airway open. Of course if you are not used to doing it, once you fall to sleep, all bets are off. But tongue pressed into the roof of your mouth is really the natural place where your tongue is supposed to go when you are not talking, eating, drinking or yawning. If you are tongue tied, it may be difficult, uncomfortable, or if really badly tied impossible to do. Anyway, if you are able to practice keeping your tongue pressed into the roof of your mouth, you may find that it can help with self soothing and even reducing mild sinus congestion. I've actually gotten very good at making sure I breath through my nose because I have to wear a bite splint at night to keep from grinding my teeth off and ever since I learned how badly I was tongue tied and how badly orthodontics messed me up 40 years ago, I've made a point of practicing pressing my tongue up into the roof of my mouth rather than letting it press against my teeth.
There are oral stop snoring appliances out there. Some are made to reposition your jaw but in some cases, a bite splint sort of device may be able to help keep your mouth sealed and if you practice sealing your tongue to the roof of your mouth it will block the air from getting to your cheeks and lips.

[Iancdub88]

I know you probably won't believe this but I can talk, blow raspberries, yawn or whatever with my mouth open but no air exits the mouth because I can block the back door so that no air pressure even enters the mouth at all so no chance of chipmunk cheeks. It's a reflex action similar to when you blow up a balloon no air tries to exit through the nose.
I can't explain what I do though. It's a reflex.

Can you pass this power onto me?

I'm not sure how Pugsy does it but try sealing your tongue to the roof of your mouth. Pressing your tongue into the roof of your mouth will generally help you keep your mouth shut and probably help keep your airway open. Of course if you are not used to doing it, once you fall to sleep, all bets are off. But tongue pressed into the roof of your mouth is really the natural place where your tongue is supposed to go when you are not talking, eating, drinking or yawning. If you are tongue tied, it may be difficult, uncomfortable, or if really badly tied impossible to do. Anyway, if you are able to practice keeping your tongue pressed into the roof of your mouth, you may find that it can help with self soothing and even reducing mild sinus congestion. I've actually gotten very good at making sure I breath through my nose because I have to wear a bite splint at night to keep from grinding my teeth off and ever since I learned how badly I was tongue tied and how badly orthodontics messed me up 40 years ago, I've made a point of practicing pressing my tongue up into the roof of my mouth rather than letting it press against my teeth.
There are oral stop snoring appliances out there. Some are made to reposition your jaw but in some cases, a bite splint sort of device may be able to help keep your mouth sealed and if you practice sealing your tongue to the roof of your mouth it will block the air from getting to your cheeks and lips.

I have actually been practicing this technique for a couple of weeks now. I just hope it will start staying there once I actually fall asleep.

[TCLynx]

I have actually been practicing this technique for a couple of weeks now. I just hope it will start staying there once I actually fall asleep.

Yea, I know it's hard. Now really sucking your tongue up to the roof of your mouth can have a soothing effect (kinda like a baby sucking their thumb.) Stimulating the nerves in the roof of the mouth helps with digestion I guess. Might be part of why babies with bad tongue ties tend to get colic because their tongues have trouble reaching and pressing on the roof of their mouth. Once you really get used to it you may really miss it if you get congested and can't breath through you nose.

[Iancdub88]

I have actually been practicing this technique for a couple of weeks now. I just hope it will start staying there once I actually fall asleep.

Yea, I know it's hard. Now really sucking your tongue up to the roof of your mouth can have a soothing effect (kinda like a baby sucking their thumb.) Stimulating the nerves in the roof of the mouth helps with digestion I guess. Might be part of why babies with bad tongue ties tend to get colic because their tongues have trouble reaching and pressing on the roof of their mouth. Once you really get used to it you may really miss it if you get congested and can't breath through you nose.

I've gotten to a point where it stays at the roof of my mouth most of the day and night. But as soon as I hit REM sleep, it relaxes, air rushes into my mouth and bam, I'm awake. I'm getting really frustrated with cpap. Every time I think I've figure it out, a new problem arises and I have not had a good night's sleep in a month and a half.

[TCLynx]

I have not had a good night's sleep in a month and a half.

I feel for ya. Dad has sleep apnea and dementia (or I sometimes think that perhaps the sleep deprivation has caused the dementia) but anyway, from Late October last year till Late January I was handling dealing with my Dad's late night wake-ups all on my own and I was a total zombie to the point where family said you HAVE TO HIRE AN AIDE or you will die before your father. I'm just hoping we can get dad's apnea treated enough that his quality of life doesn't continue deteriorating nearly so fast.

Good Luck finding something that works. Have you discussed inspire with your doctor? I believe that one works by stimulating the nerves/muscles to keep your tongue from falling back when you relax, I wonder if that would be appropriate for your type of case. I wonder does anyone know if they have a way to test of inspire would work before having to have surgery? Like would a muscle stim device be able to work say in a sleep study?

I don't think that sort of thing would be an option for my dad since his problem is central sleep apnea more than the obstructive apnea (we can use positional therapy to minimize the obstructive events for him but he is still having centrals.)

[Iancdub88]

Good Luck finding something that works. Have you discussed inspire with your doctor? I believe that one works by stimulating the nerves/muscles to keep your tongue from falling back when you relax, I wonder if that would be appropriate for your type of case. I wonder does anyone know if they have a way to test of inspire would work before having to have surgery? Like would a muscle stim device be able to work say in a sleep study?

I am so sorry you're going through all of that. It must be so heartbreaking to see that happening to a loved one, I can't even imagine.

As far as the Inspire goes, I have heard so many horror stories about it that I think I'd rather just go untreated as bad as that sounds. Beyond that, I've heard it's not super effective for people with severe OSA which is what I have. Last night was better, I think I'm getting there. I just have a lot of days where giving up seems like the most appealing option.