After converting to a nasal mask a week or so ago, I've made progress but I'm still having an occasional blow out, and wondering if this gets better by itself or if one can train oneself so that it becomes less of a problem.
I've tried the FF mask, but it raises my AHI, and I know about the tape, but my sinuses clog sometimes, so that idea's a non-starter. I think that just leaves a chin strap or possibly training myself to not pop my mouth open. I'm warming up to the possibility of using a chin strap, but wonder if anyone's been successful at just taining themself to not pop their mouth open.
It also seems like my mouth might be popping open when my sinuses clog up, although I haven't really verified that yet.
Anyone been successful at learning to not do this?
Regards,
Bill (looking for
Learning to Keep Mouth Closed
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NightHawkeye
- Posts: 2431
- Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 11:55 am
- Location: Iowa - The Hawkeye State
Yes, I have been able to train myself. The trick I found was to be real conscious of where I place my tongue as I go to sleep. I make sure I tuck the tip up against the roof, right behind the ridge. I also practiced it during the day, making sure I was aware of it when I breathed through my nose.
I found a chin strap didn't stop me from opening my mouth, but it did serve as a good mnemonic reminding me how to place my tongue. When I woke up mouth breathing I just started automatically moving my tongue to the right place. Took a month or so, but the chin strap has been put away for some time now.
If you can't find you can train yoruself, you might consider the DYI mouthpiece. It also works as a good training assist and training aid.
I found a chin strap didn't stop me from opening my mouth, but it did serve as a good mnemonic reminding me how to place my tongue. When I woke up mouth breathing I just started automatically moving my tongue to the right place. Took a month or so, but the chin strap has been put away for some time now.
If you can't find you can train yoruself, you might consider the DYI mouthpiece. It also works as a good training assist and training aid.
Chin Strap
I had buck teeth as a kid and grew up as mouth breather. I wore braces, but my dentist just shakes his head and says "You have big teeth!"
I was stunned when my dme gave me a nasal mask because I have sinus issues as well. he gave me a chin strap and it has worked beautifully.
Maybe some people can train themselves not to breathe out of their mouths, but this chin strap works well for me. I just have the basic one, not anything fancy. Just one less thing to worry about and it has been the cheapest thing I've had to buy!
Oh yea - the taping kinda scared me - I have roseaca and anything sticky breaks my face out. Even a simple hypo-allergenic bandaid!
I was stunned when my dme gave me a nasal mask because I have sinus issues as well. he gave me a chin strap and it has worked beautifully.
Maybe some people can train themselves not to breathe out of their mouths, but this chin strap works well for me. I just have the basic one, not anything fancy. Just one less thing to worry about and it has been the cheapest thing I've had to buy!
Oh yea - the taping kinda scared me - I have roseaca and anything sticky breaks my face out. Even a simple hypo-allergenic bandaid!
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| Mask | ||||
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| Additional Comments: Aussie Heated hose for rain out/PapCap Headgear and chin strap | ||||
mikemoran wrote: If you can't find you can train yoruself, you might consider the DYI mouthpiece. It also works as a good training assist and training aid.
DIY mouthpiece? Is this the "weld two boil and bite teethguard" method or is this a new one? I'd be interested in more info, sir.
I have been using a nose mask for a few weeks now (newbie cpap user), and found myself waking because I sounded like a raspberry, with vibrating lips. I usually sleep with my mouth closed tightly, but at 13cm, I can feel the little leak of air forcing its way around my gums. I'm using tape now, and even though I'm getting comfortable sleep, It's tough pulling the tape off each morning. (although I think i'd stay out of more trouble if I left it on except to eat!) I'm asking my doc to prescribe a full face mask, but if your solution works, heck I'll try it. It'll probably be more cost-effective also!
Thanks
_________________
| Mask: ComfortGel Blue Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear |
| Humidifier: S9™ Series H5i™ Heated Humidifier with Climate Control |
| Additional Comments: Resmed S9 CPAP w/ Humidifier (I don't know about H5i, etc) |
I had always thought I was a mouth breather. The doctor said to give a nasal mask a try and I really haven't had much difficulty.
On occastion I'll let a little air slip but it's no big deal. If it wakes me up I just close my mouth and go back to sleep.
The data indicates that I do not have much leakage so it seems I'm not all that much of a mouth breather after all.
Jim
On occastion I'll let a little air slip but it's no big deal. If it wakes me up I just close my mouth and go back to sleep.
The data indicates that I do not have much leakage so it seems I'm not all that much of a mouth breather after all.
Jim
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GrumpyInKC
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 3:01 pm
I've been using a cpap for about a month now and I've always been a nose breather so I haven't had any problems with mouth leakage. In fact if my nose is plugged I can't sleep at all as breathing through my mouth will keep me awake all night.
But I have a funny story about mouth leakage, well funny to me at least. The other night I'm haveing a dream, all of a sudden I'm at a protest. I'm not sure what the protest is about but our group is squared off against another group and I'm trying to yell some slogan at the other group at the top of my lungs. I'm able to yell the first couple first couple of times, but after that my lips just flutter and I can't get any sounds out. I try yelling a couple of more times to no avail. Suddenly I wake up and my lips really are fluttering with 9cm of air pushing through. It's funny to me how your mind can fit what is physically happening to you into a dream.
What's not funny is the dreams I used to have where I was being choked by someone who had snuck into my room but I couldn't see them because it was pitch black. At least I understand where these dreams were coming from since I've had my sleep study.
But I have a funny story about mouth leakage, well funny to me at least. The other night I'm haveing a dream, all of a sudden I'm at a protest. I'm not sure what the protest is about but our group is squared off against another group and I'm trying to yell some slogan at the other group at the top of my lungs. I'm able to yell the first couple first couple of times, but after that my lips just flutter and I can't get any sounds out. I try yelling a couple of more times to no avail. Suddenly I wake up and my lips really are fluttering with 9cm of air pushing through. It's funny to me how your mind can fit what is physically happening to you into a dream.
What's not funny is the dreams I used to have where I was being choked by someone who had snuck into my room but I couldn't see them because it was pitch black. At least I understand where these dreams were coming from since I've had my sleep study.
Interesting comments on the dreams.
I'm a 8 day newbie using a Nasal mask and I've been getting Air Bubbles sneaking by my tongue and waking me up several times a night.
I'm hoping I can train myself but it seems that there is very little room for error and if my tongue is off just a little some air will get by.
Other than that the Mirage Nasal has been pretty comfortable and forgiving. I have it sit as low as possible so the bottom of my nose doesn't get sore.
I've been trying to get the Swift to work but no luck yet - my nose goes into full rebellion - and I'm a lite sleeper so the noise is a problem.
I asked my sleep Doc's asst if I should bring my Card in so they could check my progress at my next appt to see how my treatment is going. She said, it only has compliance data (NOT) and the Doctors position is if the patient doesn't have a problem and doesn't mention anything then everything must be ok. AMAZING !!! How do they know what is going on? I'm still waking up during the night - same as before CPAP. I am dreaming more though.
You Snoozy, You Loszey,
Tom
I'm a 8 day newbie using a Nasal mask and I've been getting Air Bubbles sneaking by my tongue and waking me up several times a night.
I'm hoping I can train myself but it seems that there is very little room for error and if my tongue is off just a little some air will get by.
Other than that the Mirage Nasal has been pretty comfortable and forgiving. I have it sit as low as possible so the bottom of my nose doesn't get sore.
I've been trying to get the Swift to work but no luck yet - my nose goes into full rebellion - and I'm a lite sleeper so the noise is a problem.
I asked my sleep Doc's asst if I should bring my Card in so they could check my progress at my next appt to see how my treatment is going. She said, it only has compliance data (NOT) and the Doctors position is if the patient doesn't have a problem and doesn't mention anything then everything must be ok. AMAZING !!! How do they know what is going on? I'm still waking up during the night - same as before CPAP. I am dreaming more though.
You Snoozy, You Loszey,
Tom
I am a believer and user in the DIY tongue positioner. I have made several versions of them over time.
I think it is possible to train the tongue. I do seem to SLOWLY be getting better with time, even without the DIY device or with a very light duty version that acts more as a reminder.
A big part of the training is to take at least a minute or two EVERY night and practice opening your mouth and shutting the airflow out of your mouth on and off with JUST your tongue. I prefer to drop the tongue up and back a bit and swell it up a bit, others prefer tip of tongue against roof of mouth sealing. Dropping the tongue back seems counter-intuitive for apnea, but the CPAP does just fine blowing the pressure behind this into your lungs.
At first it seems like an effort to do this tongue sealing, if you are a mouth breather normally. After awhile its seems like effort to let the air blow out the mouth.
I think it is possible to train the tongue. I do seem to SLOWLY be getting better with time, even without the DIY device or with a very light duty version that acts more as a reminder.
A big part of the training is to take at least a minute or two EVERY night and practice opening your mouth and shutting the airflow out of your mouth on and off with JUST your tongue. I prefer to drop the tongue up and back a bit and swell it up a bit, others prefer tip of tongue against roof of mouth sealing. Dropping the tongue back seems counter-intuitive for apnea, but the CPAP does just fine blowing the pressure behind this into your lungs.
At first it seems like an effort to do this tongue sealing, if you are a mouth breather normally. After awhile its seems like effort to let the air blow out the mouth.
Remember:
What you read above is only one data point based on one person's opinion.
I am not a doctor, nor do I even play one on TV.
Your mileage may vary.
Follow ANY advice or opinions at your own risk.
Not everything you read is true.
What you read above is only one data point based on one person's opinion.
I am not a doctor, nor do I even play one on TV.
Your mileage may vary.
Follow ANY advice or opinions at your own risk.
Not everything you read is true.
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NightHawkeye
- Posts: 2431
- Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 11:55 am
- Location: Iowa - The Hawkeye State
Thanks for all the responses. I've been reading them all day, just didn't know quite how to respond. A lot of this focuses on tongue position and I'm not at all sure that will work for me, but I'll give it a shot anyway and see if it looks like I can even get a seal that way.
To tell the truth, I don't think I'm doing all that bad with the nasal interface. I do seem to wake up almost immediately when my mouth pops open and the air rushes out. But that's not all bad. At least I'm not sleeping through a long cluster of apneas.
Regards,
Bill (just keepin' on)
Actually, I've started down this road by first getting the "Sleep Pro" boil and bite appliance. It held my lower jaw out sure enough but also pushed the jaw down which seemed to induce more apneas than not using it. Problem with the Sleep Pro is it has a rather large breathing hole which keeps the jaws separated. I've been considering compressing the whole appliance so that the breathing hole is smaller, but to tell the truth the few hours I used the Sleep Pro wasn't real encouraging. Also, after I'd ordered the Sleep Pro I also picked up a couple of boil and bite mouthguards locally figuring I could fashion them into a single appliance. I haven't done that yet though.mikemoran wrote:If you can't find you can train yoruself, you might consider the DYI mouthpiece. It also works as a good training assist and training aid.
To tell the truth, I don't think I'm doing all that bad with the nasal interface. I do seem to wake up almost immediately when my mouth pops open and the air rushes out. But that's not all bad. At least I'm not sleeping through a long cluster of apneas.
Regards,
Bill (just keepin' on)
I had a 'stache
Ten years ago at my first cpap trial. I suggested to the tech that I could shave it off if it would make the seal work better. He said, Nahh! we'll get a good seal. Let's try this. Hmmm, let's try that. Hmm, how about maybe..."
By the time he got a seal to his liking, I was in great pain and thought I'd never get to sleep. The results came back that I was too marginal to prescribe the cpap solution. "Lose wieght," they said,"ten pounds and you'll stop having apnic events. Twenty pounds and you'll stop snoring altogether."
I shaved soon after, but only recently went back for another sleep study at my doctor's advice. Now I have cpap and no regrets about a clean face. I guess you have to decide on priorities.
Also, see posts about various taped mouth solutions. I'm trying the different kinds and am having pretty good results with little discomfort.
By the time he got a seal to his liking, I was in great pain and thought I'd never get to sleep. The results came back that I was too marginal to prescribe the cpap solution. "Lose wieght," they said,"ten pounds and you'll stop having apnic events. Twenty pounds and you'll stop snoring altogether."
I shaved soon after, but only recently went back for another sleep study at my doctor's advice. Now I have cpap and no regrets about a clean face. I guess you have to decide on priorities.
Also, see posts about various taped mouth solutions. I'm trying the different kinds and am having pretty good results with little discomfort.
_________________
| Mask: ComfortGel Blue Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear |
| Humidifier: S9™ Series H5i™ Heated Humidifier with Climate Control |
| Additional Comments: Resmed S9 CPAP w/ Humidifier (I don't know about H5i, etc) |
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Captain_Midnight
- Posts: 761
- Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2006 8:10 pm
- Location: The Great State of Idaho
Keeping mouth closed
Hawk - -
Early in my PAP therapy (beginning in December) I would occasionally wake up to Hurricane Rita doing a U-turn where my tonsils once were.
Little-by-little, I was able to train myself to keep the mouth closed (I'm a pretty good clincher.)
What has totally eliminated my problem, however, is the Papillow. You may have already read about it. It's a pillow for us apneacs with a U cut from the sides so the mask rests in a depression (more comfortably).
The other benefit for me is that it tends to nudge my chin up, and (at least in my case) helps keep my mouth closed. Just search on the product name if you want to see what it looks like.
(Not a recommendation to buy, just a review of a product.)
Good luck with the nasal mask, Hawk. I certainly like mine.
Regards all - - Capt Midnight
Early in my PAP therapy (beginning in December) I would occasionally wake up to Hurricane Rita doing a U-turn where my tonsils once were.
Little-by-little, I was able to train myself to keep the mouth closed (I'm a pretty good clincher.)
What has totally eliminated my problem, however, is the Papillow. You may have already read about it. It's a pillow for us apneacs with a U cut from the sides so the mask rests in a depression (more comfortably).
The other benefit for me is that it tends to nudge my chin up, and (at least in my case) helps keep my mouth closed. Just search on the product name if you want to see what it looks like.
(Not a recommendation to buy, just a review of a product.)
Good luck with the nasal mask, Hawk. I certainly like mine.
Regards all - - Capt Midnight
_________________
| Machine: DreamStation Auto CPAP Machine |
| Mask: ComfortGel Blue Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear |
| Additional Comments: APAP range = 10 - 12.5 In H20 |
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Guest
Re: bubbles
Don't sleep on your back.scooter wrote:I'm new to all of this (about a month) I find my mouth stays closed if I lie on my left side. If I lie on my right side my mouth stays closed most of the time. If i'm on my back my lips will bubble away. Any solutions for that?