Are there no rules for basic humanity in this group?

[ozzyluvshockey21]

I had noticed before I even posted my first question that more than one person was quite offensive in this group. After I posted a question and had quite egotistical, sexist and just plain jerk comments posted on it...I went looking for the group rules and found no post listing any.

I am curious, is it just a free for all for anyone to treat anyone the way they wish?

[Pugsy]

Well... there are some rules...the user agreement at the bottom of the page.

Basic humanity is in the eye of the beholder I suppose and not specifically addressed in the user agreement rules.

The forum owner doesn't really like censorship and hopes that people will sort out their differences like adults. Unfortunately it doesn't always work out that way. Adults don't always end up acting like we expect "adults" to act.

The forum is moderated but loosely because that's what the forum owner wants. There's good and bad that comes with that. It is what it is. If that isn't a person's cup of tea then there are other forums to frequent where things are much more strictly censored.

I went back and looked at your first thread and I think I know of one person you are talking about. That person was also very new to the forum and it appeared to me that his primary purpose was to just be a smart ass and a disruptor. He doesn't represent the majority of us here. That person has been dealt with for now.

Yes....you are going to see some very blunt and sometimes caustic responses here. Sometimes the truth is delivered in a manner that will leave a bad taste in one's mouth. I cringe sometimes with the bad taste I get when I see stuff like that especially when it involves new members. They haven't had the chance to learn the personalities involved with the forum veterans. I don't worry so much about the forum veterans as most of them can handle themselves...it's the newbies that I worry about.

It's not perfect here but then nothing online ever is. You have some bad tasting stuff here with the good but much more good than bad.

[raisedfist]

There are really only a few offenders here...they are just loud and obnoxious. But they are always put in their place by the lovely folks here.

It's better than a certain other board, where things are heavily censored. You can always add people to your foe list here.

[D.H.]

Just tune them out!

[Selenium1%]

Good advice from D.H.

[jnk...]

As far as I know, the rules for basic humanity are the rules that apply in every group in every place, whether those rules are posted or not.

If you think Pugsy may have missed seeing something significant in someone's post in a thread that reflects a lack of hospitality to a newcomer, I don't think Pugsy minds if that gets reported by clicking the exclamation mark up in the corner.

[chunkyfrog]

The exclamation point is fairly new.
It can be considered a "thumbs down" report on any comment you feel has crossed a line.

[Pugsy]

If you think Pugsy may have missed something significant in a thread somewhere that reflects a lack of hospitality to a newcomer, I don't think Pugsy minds if that gets reported by clicking the exclamation mark up in the corner.

I rarely miss much. Sometimes my hands are tied though. Being an asshole or rude or jerk or just a disagreeable person in general doesn't violate the user agreement terms. There's a lot of gray area here. Sometimes I sure with is wasn't so gray.
Sometimes what gets said is the truth but stated in a manner that doesn't taste so great. The truth hurts sometimes. Sometimes it just tastes bad no matter how it gets delivered. Just because something tastes bad doesn't mean it violates the user agreement terms.

Where do we draw the line and start censoring how people dish out the truth? It's a tough call.
Then there's the differing opinions thing...when and how do we start censoring how those are delivered? Another tough call.
Very little black and white and a whole lot of gray going on. The black and white part....easy job...but the gray area...man it makes for a difficult job. I gotta try to figure out intent in general or was the person just having a bad day and is being an old grouch....lord knows I am guilty of that myself. I mean well but what I say ends up tasting bad to someone and I really didn't mean it.
Then of course sometimes someone really pisses me off and I do mean it...so I assume others react the same as I do.

Johnny has made it fairly clear how he feels about censorship but he also doesn't want things to deteriorate because of one person like we had with the alphabet boy. I am straddling a teeny tiny fine line sometimes here. Figuring out where to draw it isn't easy at all and some days harder than other days because I am human and I also have my good days and bad days. You get an imperfect system all the way around. It is what it is though. Sometimes we just don't get perfect no matter how much we want it. Life just doesn't give us that.

Use the Foe button...I do. There are some folks here that I just can't stand to read anything they write so I just don't read it. Plain and simple. Takes a lot of will power to not go sneak a peek but I finally mastered it. I had to or my blood pressure would go sky high.

[jnk...]

I rarely miss much.

There are some folks here that I just can't stand to read anything they write so I just don't read it. Plain and simple.

Are you sure you want both statements in the same post?

[Pugsy]

The exclamation point is fairly new.
It can be considered a "thumbs down" report on any comment you feel has crossed a line.

It's been used a bit lately for just that but what was said didn't violate the user agreement terms.
Just because we disagree with what has been said doesn't warrant any action and none will be taken.
Just because someone is being an asshole or jerk or someone considers what they said was rude or hateful or whatever...doesn't violate the terms of agreement and no action will be taken.

This is the fine line....intent and the hardest part of this job. Is someone being an asshole just to disrupt the forum like the alphabet boy did? Just being a troll for the sole purpose of stirring up trouble? Yeah, sometimes that happens but it can't be decided on by just one or two or more posts unfortunately. Gotta swallow a lot of bad tasting stuff before the decision to just spit it out gets made.

[Pugsy]

I rarely miss much.

There are some folks here that I just can't stand to read anything they write so I just don't read it. Plain and simple.

Are you sure you want both statements in the same post?

I miss it by choice because I just can't stand the person but they rarely say anything that warrants action on my part. I just don't like them and don't want to read what they say.... If they do say something really bad then I am sure someone will report them.
They stay on the Foe list just in case they ever come back (most of my Foe list is inactive members who pissed me off for some reason) and need help I have a reminder so I won't waste my time responding.

People that are known active troublemakers or I even remotely think they are trolls or going to be troublemakers....don't go on the Foe list. New members...never go on the Foe list immediately anyway. I watch those like a hawk mainly because often new accounts end up with the member coming back and inserting spam links into signatures and stuff like that. The sneaky spammers I call them. Get a few posts under their belt and then go in and fix up a signature with spam links added so they show up on all the posts they made. They get the axe swiftly once I spot it..and I do try to watch but if you guys see one that I missed...be sure to let me know.

[jnk...]

You do good work. Seriously. Thanks for doing it.

[Superball]

There's definitely a lot of good on this forum. I've been reading pretty much since I've been diagnosed with severe OSA. By reading the advice Pugsy, LSAT, and a few others have given to other people, I've been able to dial in my machine to the point where my AHI is under 0.5 every night. I've also gotten past a couple of pretty scary episodes where CPAP caused severe hypocapnia

There's also a lot of insecurity, rudeness, close-mindedness, and just plain unhelpful garbage on this forum. One of the main reasons I created an account was so I could use the foe list and improve the signal-to-noise ratio here. There really is a ton of helpful advice to be found, just gotta deal with the crap somehow.

[Jeff_Snore_No_More]

In one users forum (not this one), there was a guy who would straight out call someone stupid or idiotic or moronic, if he felt they were asking something that he didn't agree with. He used the excuse that he was a crotchety old man, and therefore had the right. Aside from the fact that he gave old men a bad name, it's no excuse.

Then you have the users who like to say things like, "Google is your friend." That's basically the ONLY answer they give to a question. Well, it's not an answer. Somewhere in the 3,000,000,000 results may be the exact answer to the exact question, but, well, do I even have to point out the problem? Besides, why are these forums here if Google has everything you need to know about everything, including opinions on things? So to you "Google is your friend" answer lovers, I say find another standard repetitive answer. How about "Roses are red, violets are blue"? Or "If your nose runs and your feet smell, you're built upside down"? That's about as good an answer as "Google is your friend."

Then just the other day in a forum, I asked a guy who responded to my question how he knew the answer by looking at a web site we looked at. He told me how, and then said, "Is that good enough?" I took that as not only sarcasm, but unnecessary sarcasm. I told him that I was offended, and that I was going to report his post as offensive. Then I found out that in that forum, you need to achieve a Level 2 status by accumulating enough points, before you can report someone's post. So that means us Level 1 shmucks don't deserve to tell the forum administrators that someone is being personally offensive?

I'm just being a crotchety old man. I have the right.

[chunkyfrog]

I am a hungry frog.
Please stop driving off all those yummy crickets.