How do I train my self to sleep on back?

[Bigd]

Hello all
My therapy with my CPAP machine has been very positive after some break in period. I have very bad arthritis in both shoulders and find my self waking many times during the night to role from one shoulder to another. I am doing acupuncture, physical therapy and my doctor has given me a bunch of Vicodin. I would rather just sleep on my back and skip the drugs. I just seem to have some sort of mental block about sleeping on my back . If I fall asleep on my back I will wake and find my self on my side. this is strange because it really hurts to sleep on either side. Any ideas on how to train my self to back sleep?
Thanks

[archangle]

Maybe a pillow or other object on either side of you when you go to sleep? Pillows under the knees might help. Wear gym shorts with pockets and put a tennis ball in each pocket.

How about trying to sleep in a recliner?

[JayR_1945]

Well, I've awakened with pain in the shoulder I'm sleeping on too, though not so bad I need Vicodin.

For the untreated apneic, they generally discourage sleeping on the back. The tongue falls against the back of the throat increasing apneas. They originally advised sewing a tennis ball in a pocket in the middle of the back of a night shirt to prevent sleeping on ones back, for mild apnea/snoring. And CNS depressants also increase apnea. However if you're successfully on self adjusting CPAP, I would think it shouldn't make a hill of beans.

But I still tend to sleep on my side. It just feels uncomfortable to fall asleep on my back. Now, I could probably fall asleep with CPAP in a recliner. Propping myself with pillows may have the same effect. I might try this myself.

[Bigd]

Hello once again
Thanks for the comments. I already wear tape on my mouth so I could see some one walking into my room while I have a taped mouth and shakels on. As it is the grand kids want to play with pappas space mask. I think I will try the tennis ball thing. My shoulders are very painful during the night due to a bunch of crashes on motorcycles and the physical labour I did when I was younger. Still if I had to do it over I wouldn't change a thing. I real didn't think the pain was an issue until I was talking over my sleep habits with my doctor. She wanted to know how many times I was awakening during the night now I was used to my CPAP machine. I told her perhaps five or six times I would come fully awake with pain from my shoulders. She said this was too much for a restorative sleep. I have had pain injections with steroids that work very well but they only last perhaps a month and a half and I can only have them every six months. I am currently doing acupuncture.

Bigd

[Otter]

I just seem to have some sort of mental block about sleeping on my back . If I fall asleep on my back I will wake and find my self on my side. this is strange because it really hurts to sleep on either side. Any ideas on how to train my self to back sleep?

It may be you move to your side because if you stayed on your back, your OSA would wake you up. Try videotaping yourself and compare your sleep position with the events logged by your machine. You may need more pressure if you're going to sleep on your back, and even then, it may take a while for you body to get used to the idea.

[lars4life]

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[BryanC]

how long have you been on your CPAP? (if I missed that, sorry ) before I started on my CPAP, I always slept on my side, when I started using the CPAP, they TOLD ME I HAD to sleep on my back (which my doc now tells me, even being treated, that's still the WORST position you can sleep in.), but, it IS the easiest to get used to with your mask on. I used a pillow under my knees to 'train' myself to sleep on my back.... not too long before i could sleep on my back without the pillow.. ) if you insist on sleeping on your back, obviously that's your choice, if your CPAP is keeping your Apnea in check, you're doing fine I would go along with the suggestion of a pillow or something under your knees, and to the extreme, maybe one of the little wedge pillows to tilt your head up some?

[Bigd]

hello
I have been on the CPAP about two and a half months now. It is just in the past two weeks I have got the leak, rain out and mouth leak problems sorted out and gotten six to eight hours under the machine. It has been most effective for my suicidal depression and I will never sleep with out it again. Any discomfort I may have is nothing when compared to the benefits I get. I can't wait to go to bed every evening now just to see how I will feel when I wake up.
Bigd

[Hawthorne]

I have very bad Rheumatoid Arthritis and my shoulders are bad. In, fact, I have 1 artificial shoulder.

I had the arthritis long before I was diagnosed with sleep apnea and began sleeping on my back then. I just stay on my back all night and barely move. Any turning on my shoulders causes pain that wakes me and my body seems to have learned that!

I do take pain meds. Hopefully your body will learn too!

[Bigd]

Hello Hawthorne
This really isn't a CPAP problem so I tried to do this with PM but I could not get it to work. I was told that my shoulders will just keep getting worse and worse, that I should think about a joint replacement. If you don't mind could you say if the procedure was worth it for you. My shoulders hurt just about all the time but at this point it is not impacting my every day activities much, just my sleep. As I continue with the CPAP therapy I hope to get more energy to start doing some physical demanding play. I take antidepressants and will do so the rest of my life so it is not having to take meds that bother me. The problem with the narcotic pain relievers is they give me bad nightmares. Thank you for responding to me query on the main board.
Bigd

[archangle]

I wonder if it wouldn't work to somehow restrain your legs? I seem to remember seeing some sort of cloth covered foam pillow thing that went under your legs. It was some sort of commercial medical device for a friend who had broken his hip. It basically had cutouts for your legs with higher areas on both sides and between the legs.

I wonder if you couldn't make something yourself. I'm thinking something like a board you lay on your bed under your legs and strap each leg to the board. Made from appropriately soft and padded material, of course, unless you get turned on by the B&D scene.

Although now that I think about it, there are a lot of commercially made padded restraint devices available for the kinky crowd. Maybe a pair of padded leg restraints could keep you from rolling over.

It could be sort of fun trying to get the insurance company to pay for it, though.

[Hawthorne]

I had my left shoulder replaced 15 years ago. I am painfree in that shoulder, except if I try to sleep on it. The implant will possibly wear out soon and I will need a revision.

The right shoulder was very bad at the same time as the left one (15 years ago) but I did some intensive physiotherapy and saved it then. Now it is gone as well and an Orthopedic surgeon has been tracking is with me for 2 years now. The pain is quite bad these last 2 weeks and I see the surgeon again on May 3. I expect he will want to do something this time. After the 1st visit for this right shoulder, physiotherapy again got the pain under pretty good control but it is way worse again now. I seem to sleep okay - thanks to pain meds- but it can get quite painful and limiting as I try to do things during the day now.

I was happy to get the left one done and be pain free but the after surgery physio was not great for that one (not an experience physiotherapist) and, while painfree, I have somewhat limited range (not bad but limited). I have been reluctant to have the right one replaced because of the possibility of limited range in it as well but may no longer have a choice because of the pain, which is causing limited range anyway.

I don't take antidepressants. My narcotic pain meds for my RA and not specifically the shoulder, do not cause nightmares. I wonder (I am not a doctor) if the antidepressants are causing the nightmares. Are nightmares a possible side effect of them?

I will try sending you a PM with my email address so that we can do this off board if you want more information.

[Slartybartfast]

Don't know what happened to my previous post? I have a little 8 lb puppy, a Cairn Terrier who sleeps
on top of me on top of my covers. She likes the air from my vent of my mask. I love my puppy
and cannot kick her off me, so I remain still on my back. Works for me.

15 lb. tomcat here. This one kills rats and squirrels and the occasional rabbit. Doesn't seem to bother with anything as small as mice. If I happen to roll over on my back, he's immediately there in the blanket-hammock between my legs, as happy as can be. If I try to move, he makes a low rumbling growl.

So I try to sleep on my side.

[archangle]

15 lb. tomcat here. This one kills rats and squirrels and the occasional rabbit. Doesn't seem to bother with anything as small as mice. If I happen to roll over on my back, he's immediately there in the blanket-hammock between my legs, as happy as can be. If I try to move, he makes a low rumbling growl.

So I try to sleep on my side.

You know, there might be a good idea here. Put a blanket over your legs, put something heavy between your legs, and maybe on either side. Makes it hard to turn over.

I'm trying to figure out an appropriate size, weight, and softness weight to use. A sandbag would be good, but I'd be too afraid it would break.

[Bigd]

Hello
Thank you all for your sugestions. I tried the tennis ball thing last night and it worked. It did wake me up when I tried to role over. Looks like I will have to get used to this but if I can sleep with a CPAP mask and gag on I can get used to any thing. I will let you all know how I am doing on my back. BTW I do sleep with my little 10 pound dog under the covers and at my feet. My wife moved to a different bedroom due to my snoring but the dog stayed by me.
Bigd