Meaning of ASV settings

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
sickwithapnea17
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Meaning of ASV settings

Post by sickwithapnea17 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 6:00 pm

This is copied from the ASV thread from Mr. Fisher. Many thanks to Mr. Fisher and the other ASV posters

Min Vent:?
Apnea: alarm for apnea event- could wake you up from sleeping

Ti:?

BPM: Breaths per minute, so if you set this on 20 will you the machine automatically make you breathe every 3 seconds?
I am trying 10 BPM again, original setting, but it seems like 1 breath every 6 seconds isn't enough?

Flex:
First, I do know that "Flex" is a technology first developed by Respironics to address the discomfort of sleeping against a continuous pressure provided by CPAP units. This technology/technique drops the pressuring during the expiration phase of breathing. It is NOT Bi-Level PAP therapy (BiPAP), which has a prescribed pressure for both inhalation and exhalation. Rather, it drops the pressure during exhalation to make it easier to breathe. As I've noted before, this drop does not "support" breathing. The pressure will not be enough to maintain an open airway.

Respironics then went on to create different Flex technologies for different types of units. For example, there is a Flex technology for BiPAP units. But they basically work on the same principle - decreasing the pressure a little during exhalation to make it easier to breathe.

The 1 to 3 denotes the drop off in pressure during the expiration phase of breathing. The least decrease in pressure is at a setting of 1. The greatest decrease in pressure is at a setting of 3.


Rise Time:
Second, the "Rise Time" value on the ASV unit shows the ventilator background of the ASV units. Rise time determines the speed with which the flow or pressure of the ventilator rises from exhalation to inhalation. The time it takes for this switch from one to the other is the "Rise Time".

A rise time of one (1) is a VERY short rise from exhalation to inhalation. Most people would find that to be COMPLETELY unacceptable. To me (when I've tinkered with it) it feels as if I was suddenly having some shop pressure tool pumping me full of air. No thanks!

A rise time of six (6) is much longer time to rise from exhalation to inhalation. Most people may find that to be too long. In fact, it might actually limit the amount of air that you inhale. If it is too long and you the unit decides you have not cycled your breathing it might actually truncate the intake and switch you to exhalation pressure. Also not good. To compensate, a long rise time may require a higher pressure from the ASV to meet your needs.

So, you might try to see if a Rise Time of 5 or 4 would help reduce the high pressures, by moving you more quickly to the inhalation pressure. But don't overdo it by moving to a Rise Time of 2 or 3. You would feel very rushed in that case.
ameriken wrote:... Can these settings impact therapy and AHI? ...
Absolutely, see the last graph in the following summary of a couple studies. At 3 the pressure decreases to the point that the number of obstructive sleep apnea events increase. The more you back off the pressure, the more it is likely the pressure will not be enough to avoid an obstructive apnea.

http://cflex.respironics.com/PDF/101663 ... tudies.pdf

Interestingly, due to the decreased pressure the studies confirm my own experience. I got better sleep with a C-Flex setting of 1.

As to the Rise Time setting, as you can see a slightly lower Rise Time might decrease the top pressure to help you attain normal respiration during a central apnea.

Edit: My philips bipapst only has rise time of 1-3
Last edited by sickwithapnea17 on Sat Oct 08, 2011 5:59 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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moresleep
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by moresleep » Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:00 pm

I'm not sure which is yours and which you've copied from the other thread. But, BPM=17 strikes me as way too high. I would set it back to 10, or, use the "Auto" setting. More is not necessarily better with this setting...

sickwithapnea17
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by sickwithapnea17 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:11 pm

thanks very much!
I don't really know anything about ASVs, this is mostly from Fisher on the ASV thread. this way you don't know have to read through everything
should I adjust the Ti, apnea, settings? should I go with 18/14 even though I seem to wake up a lot on this setting? I was getting oa's now one day this last week though usually I get clear airway apneas or hypopneas.

Is the bipap st the better machine or should I use the PR bipap auto with bi flex?
Last edited by sickwithapnea17 on Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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cflame1
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by cflame1 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:23 pm

I think that you need to go with what your doc has prescribed... rather than changing your settings every night (or close to that). You need to be under a doc's care.

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ameriken
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by ameriken » Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:55 pm

sickwithapnea17 wrote:This is copied from the ASV thread from Mr. Fisher. Many thanks to Mr. Fisher and the other ASV posters

Min Vent:?
Apnea:?
Ti:?
BPM: Breaths per minute
I'm not sure about your machine, however on mine I think the 'apnea' setting is an alarm that will go off when the apnea has reached the # of seconds you've set the alarm for.
Thinking of quitting CPAP?

No problem, here's the first thing to do when you quit:


Advanced funeral planning. When you give up CPAP, you'll probably need it.

sickwithapnea17
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by sickwithapnea17 » Sat Oct 08, 2011 6:00 pm

moresleep wrote:I'm not sure which is yours and which you've copied from the other thread. But, BPM=17 strikes me as way too high. I would set it back to 10, or, use the "Auto" setting. More is not necessarily better with this setting...
why are higher BPM's bad? isn't 10 too low if it means that you breath only once every 6 seconds?
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jamiswolf
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by jamiswolf » Sat Oct 08, 2011 9:32 pm

sickwithapnea17 wrote: why are higher BPM's bad? isn't 10 too low if it means that you breath only once every 6 seconds?
You want to give your body the opportunity to breath for itself. If you set the BPM too high it will preempt your own respiratory effort.

It is a back-up rate in case your body forgets to breath.
J

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ameriken
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by ameriken » Sat Oct 08, 2011 9:50 pm

sickwithapnea17 wrote:
moresleep wrote:I'm not sure which is yours and which you've copied from the other thread. But, BPM=17 strikes me as way too high. I would set it back to 10, or, use the "Auto" setting. More is not necessarily better with this setting...
why are higher BPM's bad? isn't 10 too low if it means that you breath only once every 6 seconds?
Like Jamiswolf said, the 'auto' setting is a back up rate of 10 bpm. Normal bpm will be somewhere between 12 and 20. The ASV just goes along with your breathing, it doesn't force bpm's until you stop breathing. If that happens the auot kicks in an keeps you going at a minimum of 10 bpm until your own body decides to breathe again.

On the software, when my PTB's (patient trigger breathing) falls through the floor, it will show my bpm at 10 because the machine is keeping me going during that time.
Thinking of quitting CPAP?

No problem, here's the first thing to do when you quit:


Advanced funeral planning. When you give up CPAP, you'll probably need it.

moresleep
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by moresleep » Sat Oct 08, 2011 10:08 pm

Remember, people without sleep apnea experience some "central" events without anything being wrong. It is normal, when changing sleep position or whatever, ocassionally to pause a bit in breathing before resuming a steady pattern again. So, you don't want the ASV function to kick in the moment your breathing falls below the recent average rate. What is normal here also varies somewhat with age. The ASV machines use the last several minutes of data to calculate the point at which they should intervene, apparently adding a "normal pause" factor to the recent average BPM rate. The Respironics ASV allows you to take it off the "auto" mode and set your own back up rate. (One of the reasons I like it.) After some experimentation, I find that if I do not use "auto," that a setting of BPM=7 or BPM=8 works well for me. You are not striving for hyperventilation here, just normal breathing and no O2 desaturations.

sickwithapnea17
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by sickwithapnea17 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:32 pm

thanks for the feedback.
but if the machine waits too long and your bpm is set too low then won't your O2 start falling? or conversely if your bpm is too high maybe it may interrupt your sleep or prevent you from getting stage 3/4 sleep
what exactly is the Ti setting?
I have a bipap st so I don't have an auto bpm and set mine on 13 which is lower than my average of 15.5
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moresleep
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by moresleep » Sat Oct 15, 2011 9:00 pm

Ti, at least on my ASV, is the Timed Inpiration time, or time the machine allows for me to complete inhaling before it switches pressures.

Since you use a Bipap S/T machine, it might help to post under a Subject like "Bipap S/T Settings," to attract uses of a machine like yours, who will have more knowledge of S/T settings.

Please be careful about changing ANY settings before you understand fully their purpose. People on this board can help you in deciding whether changes are needed.

sickwithapnea17
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by sickwithapnea17 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 10:56 pm

thanks so much! I seem to get better sleep last night when I set TI on 2.0 instead of 1.0.
they hypopneas went down to about 1.3 or something
mentally I seem a little better but still having chronic fatigue
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jules
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by jules » Sat Oct 15, 2011 11:06 pm

i agree with cflame1's comment above

and you also need to be upfront with your doctor about all the meds and herbal stuff you are taking - ALL OF IT

sickwithapnea17
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Re: Meaning of ASV settings

Post by sickwithapnea17 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 11:08 pm

no changing the settings has helped-maybe 18/14 is too high. unfortunately my bipap st doesn't have auto bpm
I don't know why the HECK they gave me bipap st when I could have gotten an asv for the same price?
maybe the doc tried to screw me for complaining too much

my bipap st also doesn't have min epap or ipap settings or ps settings for some reason- but I'm guessing it's better than philips auto bipap with autoflex since it has a backup for my centrals?
18/14 bipap st