Oxygen concentrators - some questions

[JDS74]

I think I'm about to embark on oxygen supplementation in addition to my ASV cpap therapy.
I've had two nights so far this months with SpO2 level below 88% for over 7 minutes and two more over 4 minutes. So I'll be talking with my sleep doctor to see where we go from here.

So some questions before I go down that path.

1. Do O2 DMEs behave the same way as cpap DMEs regarding lowest cost to them, etc.?
2. What features are the desirable ones to have?
3. Are there particular models that are quieter than others?
4. Are there any models that automatically turn when the power is turned on? I understand that its a bad idea to have the O2 concentrator running while the cpap is not. That leads to the idea of a remote control or timer to insure that.
5. Any personal experience that is especially positive or negative with particular manufacturers and/or models.

Thank you for any information that you think will help.

[palerider]

1. Do O2 DMEs behave the same way as cpap DMEs regarding lowest cost to them, etc.?
2. What features are the desirable ones to have?
3. Are there particular models that are quieter than others?
4. Are there any models that automatically turn when the power is turned on? I understand that its a bad idea to have the O2 concentrator running while the cpap is not. That leads to the idea of a remote control or timer to insure that.
5. Any personal experience that is especially positive or negative with particular manufacturers and/or models.

1. dunno, got my friends off craigslist (brand new, zero hours, in box). it's the white one from this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEGyUHXtUuo
2. o2 quality monitor (like the two in the video have.
3. oh yes... refer to video
4. I don't know. my friend just turns on the invacare and then turns on his cpap.
5. only with the invacare perfecto2. it makes whirring noise, and a thumping every few seconds as it switches between filtering and purging, but it's not very loud. he sleeps with it at the foot of his bed. I can hear the thumps if the air conditioner is off, faintly, just enough to know that it's still working. it was dead simple to set up, just pull it out of the box, attach the hose, stick the o2 adapter on the back of the asv, turn on and adjust the flow.

[bwexler]

I have been using the Resperonics unit (the blue one in the video) for almost 4 years.
In the late 90s I had 2 of the older grey units, the predesessor of the white one in the video.
They are both built like a tank and seem to be the most common ones provided.
The DMEs like the idea of pepetual rental at about 20% per month of the purchase price. They justify that by including service.they come out every couple months and check the nob to insure your still getting your prescibed pressure, they proved new tubing and canulas and a new filter every year or so. If you request it they will check the flow rate and the O2 percentage. The Filters, tubing and canulas (you don't use the canula with CPAP) are about $6 each from our sponser. So it only costs about $240 for teh tech to deliver the items and check the flow rate knob hasn't moved itself.
In many cases you may deal with the same DME for both CPAP and O2.

The noise is the primary measure of satifaction. they are both too noisey for me, so I keep mine in another room and use a 25' tubing to connect to my mask.
I have not used the newer white unit, but I prefer the blue one because it is marginaly quieter.

I don't concern myself with leaving the O2 on. My routine is to turn it on, on my way to the rest room before I return to mask up and go to bed. Morning is reverse. If I get up for night time bathroom break it stays on. As long as no one is smoking around it and you have no open flames close I don't see a problem.

[JDS74]

Thanks for the replies.
I think I prefer outright purchase and not the rent endlessly scheme that DMEs seem to prefer.

[bwexler]

That is a downright sinister attitude.

How do you expect DMEs to feed their children?

[palerider]

That is a downright sinister attitude.

How do you expect DMEs to feed their children?

what makes you think they *have* children? from the stories I hear, most of them seem to have crawled out of the primordial ooze.

[Jack_Russel_Fan]

I also use supplemental oxygen with my Bipap therapy. A few thoughts and comments I have:

Concentrator noise levels - It's been my experience that Invacare home units are fairly noisy. I have mine located in another room. The machines I have
used are older, so the newer ones may be quieter.

Buy or rent - I rented at first, but I felt like I was throwing away my money. I bought a refurbished 5L unit for $475 with a one-year warranty.

BackFlow - An inline valve can be purchased to prevent this, but I personally do not use one. However, some manufacturers do specifically require one.

Regarding use of supplemental oxygen - Care should be used as you can overdose on it, especially if you have COPD!

[JDS74]

Thank you for your comments. I do not plan on winging this but will seek guidance from my doctor.
I do understand that you can get into trouble with too much supplemental O2.

I'm trying to be really careful here so I have all the questions lined up before I see my doctor.

[Madalot]

I have the Invacare Perfecto2 (had mine since early 2010 and it was not new then) and I've gotten used to the noise. It's background for me when sleeping.

As far as being cautious about having the oxygen on when the ASV (Trilogy for me) -- I have trained myself to turn the equipment on & off in proper/safe order:

Night -- Turn ON in this order: Trilogy, Humidifier (mine is separate), Oxygen

Morning -- Turn OFF in reverse order: Oxygen, Humidifier, Trilogy

My RT is confident that I'm doing everything properly and I've had no issues.

[palerider]

if you're concerned about o2 in the motor on startup, just do a suckstart to trigger the autostart function ...

[mikerrt]

No such thing as a "quiet" concentrator, most will move it to another room and use longer tubing. Owning one is a head ache, routine maintenance like sieve bed replacement, filters and compressor up keep can be cumbersome. Over time, the oxygen percentage output reduces and may not meet your needs.

[Goofproof]

if you're concerned about o2 in the motor on startup, just do a suckstart to trigger the autostart function ...

If you are using a correct O2 adaptor, they will all the O2 to vent to the room when the machine is turned off. Unfortunately most O2 adapters are no more than cheap ports that don't vent. Think cheap and get cheap!!! If you do get cheap, you can leave the hose off the adaptor until you turn the xpap machine on.

2L of O2 mixed into a 40L flow of air from a XPAP, really doesn't make much of a change in your O2 intake. O2 pumps allow 50 foot of hose max. So another room is a good option, mainly because of the heat and noise they put off. Contrary to what's been posted in a above post, matainance is mostly cleaning of the filters regularly, and the O2 output checked as the hours get high. For most it's beyond the scope of the user, and parts purchace may be hard, but with the money you save out of pocket, you can replace the unit. Jim

[JDS74]

Do you have a part number and/or source for a venting adapter?
I like to opt for safer rather than cheaper.

[archangle]

if you're concerned about o2 in the motor on startup, just do a suckstart to trigger the autostart function ...

If you are using a correct O2 adaptor, they will all the O2 to vent to the room when the machine is turned off. Unfortunately most O2 adapters are no more than cheap ports that don't vent. Think cheap and get cheap!!! If you do get cheap, you can leave the hose off the adaptor until you turn the xpap machine on.

How do the correct O2 adapters work? Is there a valve that prevents backflow up the CPAP hose or is it something like an anti-asphyxia vent? Got a link to a "correct" O2 adapter?

I would think a backflow preventer would interfere with exhaling, but maybe the extra backpressure wouldn't be bad enough to matter.

I would think that as long as you turn off the CPAP and then immediately go and turn off the O2 converter, there wouldn't be a problem.

[Goofproof]

Do you have a part number and/or source for a venting adapter?
I like to opt for safer rather than cheaper.

Mine came from lincare with my first unit, it has ran away over the years, the one they gave me now is a creepy, so I unplug it from the adaptor. The good one has a ball inside that goes down when the xpap is off allowing the O2 to vent to thd room, when the machine pressure starts the ball floats and seals off the vent. To work the adapter needs to be vertical out of the HH, so it wouldn't work on the mask end.

Also for XPAP use a pulsed O2 unit is not to be used, just straight pressure. Jim

I'll search for the good one, might as well use it if I can locate it, will take pic too.