ResMed AirFit F20 FF mask riding up my face

My first night with my F20 went fairly well. I'm not up to speed with Sleepyhead yet but I'm working on that.
I woke up several times with the bottom edge of the seal riding up on my bottom lip. I'm not sure whether this was because I opened my mouth and caught the seal on my lower lip or just a tendency for the mask to ride up my face. I'm wondering if I should tighten the bottom straps.

Don't overtighten the straps.
Probably, your mouth fell open out of the mask.
I don't have the mask, but one thing you might try is a small strap looped under your chin and both bottom straps of the mask. It doesn't have to be tight, just snug to prevent your chin from falling. A Velcro strap might do. If the problem persists, you might want to try a soft cervical collar which will hold your chin up. As a last resort, there are chin straps.

Jay Aitchsee wrote:Don't overtighten the straps.
Probably, your mouth fell open out of the mask.
I don't have the mask, but one thing you might try is a small strap looped under your chin and both bottom straps of the mask. It doesn't have to be tight, just snug to prevent your chin from falling. A Velcro strap might do. If the problem persists, you might want to try a soft cervical collar which will hold your chin up. As a last resort, there are chin straps.

Thanks for the imaginative suggestions. I think some way to keep my mouth from opening too much is what I need.

Josiah wrote: Thanks for the imaginative suggestions. I think some way to keep my mouth from opening too much is what I need.

my wife tells me this all the time!

It happened to me also. While you don't want to overtighten the straps, I did tighten the bottom straps a little and it helped.

Josiah wrote:My first night with my F20 went fairly well. I'm not up to speed with Sleepyhead yet but I'm working on that.
I woke up several times with the bottom edge of the seal riding up on my bottom lip. I'm not sure whether this was because I opened my mouth and caught the seal on my lower lip or just a tendency for the mask to ride up my face. I'm wondering if I should tighten the bottom straps.

Maybe it's the wrong size.

My wife and I both use this mask. We both use a firm foam cervical collar to keep our mouth closed when sleeping. I have tried a few chin straps and find the cervical collar to be more comfortable.

Josiah wrote:My first night with my F20 went fairly well. I'm not up to speed with Sleepyhead yet but I'm working on that.
I woke up several times with the bottom edge of the seal riding up on my bottom lip. I'm not sure whether this was because I opened my mouth and caught the seal on my lower lip or just a tendency for the mask to ride up my face. I'm wondering if I should tighten the bottom straps.

A FFM is often the first mask the DME will give you and fitting and using it one of the most difficult CPAP skills to master - it require much patience and practice. It covers a much wider area of your face and is impacted by many more facial structures, shapes, and sizes than a nasal or nasal pillow. In the face of leaks and slippages, tightening the straps often is the first impulse - avoid that until you think it through. The connection between the cushion and your skin is not an edge like a windshield wiper blade, rather it curves under to form a rounded pocket like an umbrella or parachute. This pocket captures air creating a soft cushioning seal with the skin. Tightening the straps too much will flatten the connection and cause wrinkles. These wrinkles create channels for air to leak out (especially near the eyes and upper part of the nose). Size is critical too. The mask must be wide enough to enclose the entire width of the mouth (especially the crease at the sides).
The following videos may give you some useful information in these regards (two different styles, both informative - the second is ten minutes long and interrupts itself occasionally, so watch the whole thing and don't stop to soon - the third introduces a variant seal material that may be useful).
1) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CfJlZDd3t8
2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vcaEIMELKU&t=1s
3) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5E-MWhwzt_4

JimW159 wrote:A FFM is often the first mask the DME will give you and fitting and using it one of the most difficult CPAP skills to master - it require much patience and practice.

It's not difficult for everyone.

Before I started using a firm foam cervical collar, I would run two pieces of tape from the mask to under my chin. This helped to keep the mask in place and helped hold my mouth closed. If my mouth would open, it would pull the mask down slightly and keep it out of my mouth.

JimW159 wrote:

Josiah wrote:My first night with my F20 went fairly well. I'm not up to speed with Sleepyhead yet but I'm working on that.
I woke up several times with the bottom edge of the seal riding up on my bottom lip. I'm not sure whether this was because I opened my mouth and caught the seal on my lower lip or just a tendency for the mask to ride up my face. I'm wondering if I should tighten the bottom straps.

A FFM is often the first mask the DME will give you and fitting and using it one of the most difficult CPAP skills to master - it require much patience and practice. It covers a much wider area of your face and is impacted by many more facial structures, shapes, and sizes than a nasal or nasal pillow. In the face of leaks and slippages, tightening the straps often is the first impulse - avoid that until you think it through. The connection between the cushion and your skin is not an edge like a windshield wiper blade, rather it curves under to form a rounded pocket like an umbrella or parachute. This pocket captures air creating a soft cushioning seal with the skin. Tightening the straps too much will flatten the connection and cause wrinkles. These wrinkles create channels for air to leak out (especially near the eyes and upper part of the nose). Size is critical too. The mask must be wide enough to enclose the entire width of the mouth (especially the crease at the sides).
The following videos may give you some useful information in these regards (two different styles, both informative - the second is ten minutes long and interrupts itself occasionally, so watch the whole thing and don't stop to soon - the third introduces a variant seal material that may be useful).
1) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CfJlZDd3t8
2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vcaEIMELKU&t=1s
3) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5E-MWhwzt_4

On the last poll on this subject FF masks were used bt 33% of members and Pillow masks were used by 44%. There are lots of people that are comfortable with FF masks.
viewtopic/t157570/Poll-What-Mask-type-do-you-use.html

LSAT wrote:

Josiah wrote:My first night with my F20 went fairly well. I'm not up to speed with Sleepyhead yet but I'm working on that.
I woke up several times with the bottom edge of the seal riding up on my bottom lip. I'm not sure whether this was because I opened my mouth and caught the seal on my lower lip or just a tendency for the mask to ride up my face. I'm wondering if I should tighten the bottom straps.

Maybe it's the wrong size.

I agree! I put on my AirFit F20 tonight and opened my mouth as wide as it would go, and I was unable to catch the lower seal with my lower lip. I bet you need the next size up, Josiah. There should be a size guide in the box the mask came in. If not, here's a pdf. http://www.directhomemedical.com/masks- ... -gauge.pdf

I use this mask and have never had that issue. I don't think I could actually open my mouth wide enough to catch the bottom of the mask. Couple of things come to mind: 1) The mask is the wrong size for you and 2) the straps are not adjusted right and/or are too tight at the top.

With this mask I can darn near sleep on my stomach and any other position but I did find that if I had the straps cranked down too tight that I had more issues with leaks and it moving around more than if I had em a little looser.

My DME also advised me to tighten the bottom straps first and then the top straps when adjusting the mask. Maybe try that if you are not already.

Hope this helps/you are able to get it figured out,

J-

LSAT wrote: On the last poll on this subject FF masks were used bt 33% of members and Pillow masks were used by 44%. There are lots of people that are comfortable with FF masks.
viewtopic/t157570/Poll-What-Mask-type-do-you-use.html

Admittedly, that is correct. However, my point was not intended as a universal statement of an impossibility, but was related to the numbers of persons I have seen in the 10 years I have been coming to this forum that were initiated into the PAPing life by DMEs who issued FFMs without much guidance of how to make it work well. Many of those came here initially, as I did, because we needed help and the FFM was not an easy or intuitive skill to develop. Fortuately, many of those who did become comfortable with it did so without much help from DMEs but with a lot of help here.

What I have noticed is the number of new people that are obvious mouth breathers and are told that FF masks are too difficult to deal with and are encouraged to use pillows and chinstraps. From personal experience, I was given a nasal mask to start, even though I told Apria that I was a mouth breather. After 6 months of struggle, I was switched to Quattro FF mask and I have been a happy camper for the past 9 years.