apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
memphisjason
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apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by memphisjason » Tue Aug 27, 2024 5:12 pm

Hey everyone,
I'm a new user to your forum and it looks like you are very knowledgeable. I have been on CPAP 100% compliant for about 7 years. I came down with long covid in 2022, including chronic fatigue syndrome, and have never fully recovered. Early last year my OSA was well controlled around 12 PSI. I verified this with the AutoPAP setting it between 12-14 and it rarely raised. I've been having a flair up in my fatigue over the past couple of months and I sleep 12-13 hrs/night. I've started paying more attention to my data since the OSA seems to have worsened. I turned up the pressure a bit to see how I responded. This morning, my wife got out of bed a little before 7. As you can see, my apneas seem to go away for the next few hours. What could be the reason for this? Am I not sleeping deeply after that? Is there a way to see sleep phase in OSCAR? Thank you so much for your help!
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-Jason
Last edited by memphisjason on Tue Aug 27, 2024 5:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Pugsy
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by Pugsy » Tue Aug 27, 2024 5:19 pm

http://www.cpaptalk.com/viewtopic/t1585 ... eview.html


Please post your images in a little different format. The way you have it now makes it difficult what with some graphs too tiny to evaluate plus graphs that aren't needed. See above.
memphisjason wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2024 5:12 pm
Is there a way to see sleep phase in OSCAR?
OSCAR can only show you whatever the machine records and the machine has zero way to know if you were asleep or awake.
So no....you can't see sleep phases using OSCAR because the machine doesn't record it because it can't.

Now you can zoom in on the flow rate and get a decent idea as to whether you were asleep or not but that's it and you have to do it manually.

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memphisjason
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by memphisjason » Tue Aug 27, 2024 6:53 pm

Thanks Pugsy. I tried to clean that image up a bit. Good to know cpap doesn't record data for phase of sleep. I've been looking into other sleep monitors. It can be hard to untangle long covid sleep disturbance from my OSA.

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ChicagoGranny
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by ChicagoGranny » Wed Aug 28, 2024 5:56 am

memphisjason wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2024 5:12 pm
This morning, my wife got out of bed a little before 7. As you can see, my apneas seem to go away for the next few hours.
Kick her out.
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Conrad
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by Conrad » Wed Aug 28, 2024 6:58 am

Sleeping 12 to 13 hours EVERY night?

That's WAY too much sleep, you're sleeping half your life away man!!!
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memphisjason
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by memphisjason » Wed Aug 28, 2024 12:33 pm

Conrad wrote:
Wed Aug 28, 2024 6:58 am
Sleeping 12 to 13 hours EVERY night?

That's WAY too much sleep, you're sleeping half your life away man!!!
Yeah, that's why I'm here. I have an appointment with a sleep doc next month. It's likely related to long covid. I shaved yesterday to get a better seal, but last night was similar. Last year my OSA was well controlled around 12 PSI, so I hadn't paid much attention, assuming the excessive sleep was part of my long covid, but these numbers are pretty bad now.
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ChicagoGranny
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by ChicagoGranny » Wed Aug 28, 2024 4:55 pm

Your machine is running much of the night at the 16.5 max pressure you set. The majority of experienced members set the max to 20.0.

You may need more pressure than your max setting is allowing. I would set the max to 20.0 and post another chart tomorrow.

Your leak rate looks fine. Philips calculates Total Leak = Vent rate plus unintentional leak. Your leak line is about where it should be.
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robysue1
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by robysue1 » Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:27 am

memphisjason wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2024 5:12 pm
This morning, my wife got out of bed a little before 7. As you can see, my apneas seem to go away for the next few hours. What could be the reason for this?
The simplest reason might be a change in sleeping position.

Do you still have a copy of your diagnostic sleep test? If so, do you know whether your apnea is significantly worse when sleeping on your back? Is it significantly worse in REM sleep?

You also write:
Early last year my OSA was well controlled around 12 PSI. I verified this with the AutoPAP setting it between 12-14 and it rarely raised. I've been having a flair up in my fatigue over the past couple of months and I sleep 12-13 hrs/night. I've started paying more attention to my data since the OSA seems to have worsened. I turned up the pressure a bit to see how I responded.
Given the mess of events on the night you posted, it's no surprise to say that your treated apnea appears to be worse (possibly much worse) than it was a year ago. If this were my data and I was sleeping 12+ hours on most nights, I'd be trying to get the sleep doc to authorize a sleep test with an APAP at the current settings just to see what's going on. Or perhaps a new in-lab titration study might be warranted. (Getting insurance to pay for it is a whole different ball of wax.)

In terms of self-help: If you are comfortable with the idea, you could try increasing your minimum pressure setting to 15.5 and setting the max pressure at 20 cm for a few nights just to see what happens in terms of trying to break up those clusters of events that kept happening between 3:00 and 7:00 on this night.
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memphisjason
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by memphisjason » Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:54 am

Thanks guys! I've been bumping the pressure gradually, but I might as well set the max to 20. I'm going to try taking away a pillow as well as a possible postural solution. I can try to get a hold of that initial sleep test, I probably need it for my upcoming appointment anyway. I had to find a new sleep doctor, as I hadn't really been back since my compliance period was over, which was 7ish years ago. I was 100% compliant and the cpap treatment was fine for many years. I had to find a new sleep doctor, I think I'm going to inquire about tonsillectomy. This was floated initially years ago, but the cpap seemed to be less invasive and solve the problem at the time. I think the situation has changed enough to reevaluate that decision.

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ChicagoGranny
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by ChicagoGranny » Thu Aug 29, 2024 1:17 pm

memphisjason wrote:
Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:54 am
I'm going to try taking away a pillow as well as a possible postural solution.
Find some sites that show proper pillow height for side and back sleeping. The spine should be protected.

Image
memphisjason wrote:
Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:54 am
I had to find a new sleep doctor, I think I'm going to inquire about tonsillectomy.
A sleep doctor can give an opinion, but you should see an ENT. I couldn't say it would be your case, but tonsillectomies have cured some people of sleep apnea.
"It's not the number of breaths we take, it's the number of moments that take our breath away."

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memphisjason
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by memphisjason » Thu Aug 29, 2024 2:53 pm

ChicagoGranny wrote:
Thu Aug 29, 2024 1:17 pm
memphisjason wrote:
Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:54 am
I'm going to try taking away a pillow as well as a possible postural solution.
Find some sites that show proper pillow height for side and back sleeping. The spine should be protected.

Image

Thanks! Yes, I'm thinking I might that X one on the left middle.
memphisjason wrote:
Thu Aug 29, 2024 9:54 am
I had to find a new sleep doctor, I think I'm going to inquire about tonsillectomy.
A sleep doctor can give an opinion, but you should see an ENT. I couldn't say it would be your case, but tonsillectomies have cured some people of sleep apnea.
I have really big tonsils, an allergist commented on it once. I was referred to an ENT many years ago, but the doctor didn't really look at my tonsils and just gave me standard odds. I'm hoping to find a doctor that can give me an opinion on whether I'm a good candidate for tonsillectomy based on tonsil size. I had been patiently hoping there would be a less painful surgery for it eventually, but it may be time to bite the bullet.

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ChicagoGranny
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by ChicagoGranny » Thu Aug 29, 2024 3:43 pm

memphisjason wrote:
Thu Aug 29, 2024 2:53 pm
Thanks! Yes, I'm thinking I might that X one on the left middle.
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him take care of his spine.
"It's not the number of breaths we take, it's the number of moments that take our breath away."

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memphisjason
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by memphisjason » Fri Aug 30, 2024 9:14 am

Here we go, max pressure raised to 20, one pillow removed. I'm glad I made an appointment with a sleep doctor (although Granny is probably right about the ENT). I don't like the medical care in my county so I was able to get an appointment at the Mayo Clinic.
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ChicagoGranny
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by ChicagoGranny » Fri Aug 30, 2024 5:02 pm

Your pressure maxed out at 20.0. That, of course, is a high pressure need.

Which positions do you sleep in? Might you have slept on your sides for much of the night but rolled onto your back from approximately 2:00 to 4:30? Pressure needs are commonly higher on the back.

Another possibility is bending the neck so that the chin drops closer to the chest. This can crimp the airway causing higher pressure needs.
memphisjason wrote:
Fri Aug 30, 2024 9:14 am
I'm glad I made an appointment with a sleep doctor (although Granny is probably right about the ENT).
Oh, it's fine to see a sleep doctor. Hopefully, he will refer you to an ENT if your tonsils are enlarged.
"It's not the number of breaths we take, it's the number of moments that take our breath away."

Cuando cuentes cuentos, cuenta cuántas cuentos cuentas.

memphisjason
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Re: apneas stop when wife gets out of bed?

Post by memphisjason » Sat Aug 31, 2024 9:09 am

Looks like the apnea does get worse when I'm on my back. I woke up around 130 or 2 made a conscious effort to roll onto my side and sleep that way. Not a very difficult change to help in the mean time, but I think I'm surgery bound.
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