Long term effects of its use

Truth behind talking points · Post by **Truth behind talking points** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:55 pm

Is there any long term study of the use of the CPAP machine? I was diagnosed a slight apnea problem. According to my Doctor I do not need the machine, but since I barely qualify for it she recommended that I use it for the apnea and snoring problems. I have been researching it and it looks like there is tons of good marketing for it, but there are very short in facts with regards to the downside of it. I am fairly young, and the idea of being slave to a machine for the next 60 years of my life is a scary one.

1) Are there any unbiased, peer-reviewed studies of the long term use of the CPAP machine?
2) Are there any studies of persons that stop using it? For example, if I start and then stop after a year, will I return to slight apnea, or will I then have full apnea?
3) What happens to a person’s that has bee habituated to the machine and try to take a nap without it? Will he/she be able to nap?

Will the documented side effect of nasal congestion make me even more dependent on the machine?
After seeing how cigarette companies advertise something that was easy to start using and hard to stop, I am very careful starting something that I will not be able to stop. The adds, web page, and forum have language that is very similar to the ones used to defend the cigarettes. After all the definition of a trap is something easy to start, but impossible to stop.

Is the CPAP Machine a trap designed to treat the symptom while increasing the underlying root cause (congestion)?

howkim · Post by **howkim** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:54 pm

Really, there's no need to post the same message twice.

You're definitely not the youngest person to use an xPAP. They're used with premature infants in neonatal ICUs. They frequently stop using them when they get out of the hospital and go on to be normal people.

If you want research studies, look in http://www.pubmed.com. You will have to work through the tutorial first, as it's not precisely intuitive. If you are too impatient to work through the tutorial, you will not find what you are looking for. For some reason, I suspect that you will be too impatient.

I guess I have a problem with your attitude, too.

roster · Post by **roster** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:11 pm

Truth behind talking points wrote: Is there any long term study of the use of the CPAP machine? I was diagnosed a slight apnea problem. According to my Doctor I do not need the machine, but since I barely qualify for it she recommended that I use it for the apnea and snoring problems. I have been researching it and it looks like there is tons of good marketing for it, but there are very short in facts with regards to the downside of it. I am fairly young, and the idea of being slave to a machine for the next 60 years of my life is a scary one.

1) Are there any unbiased, peer-reviewed studies of the long term use of the CPAP machine?
2) Are there any studies of persons that stop using it? For example, if I start and then stop after a year, will I return to slight apnea, or will I then have full apnea?
3) What happens to a person’s that has bee habituated to the machine and try to take a nap without it? Will he/she be able to nap?

Will the documented side effect of nasal congestion make me even more dependent on the machine?
After seeing how cigarette companies advertise something that was easy to start using and hard to stop, I am very careful starting something that I will not be able to stop. The adds, web page, and forum have language that is very similar to the ones used to defend the cigarettes. After all the definition of a trap is something easy to start, but impossible to stop.

Is the CPAP Machine a trap designed to treat the symptom while increasing the underlying root cause (congestion)?

I will say the guest name you chose is far from the way you posted.

We are not slaves to our machines. We have an oppressive condition that our machines help us deal with.

Did your doctor tell you that sleep apnea is a progressive condition? If you have it at a young age, it is likely to become more severe over time.

If you really think congestion is the underlying cause, you need to do some more research. Try reading all the articles on Dr. Park's website http://doctorstevenpark.com/recentarticles.

You have a great opportunity that most of us missed. We would have loved to have our apnea diagnosed and treated at a young age with the good technologies that are available today. It would have saved us years of permanent damage to our brains and bodies.

Beyond talking points · Post by **Beyond talking points** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:13 pm

Thank you for the link. I am a resourceful researcher; I will go through the tutorial.

From my point of view; a decision that will affect the next 60 to 70 years of my life is an emotional one. I am sorry if I offended somebody with my points of view, but it is hard to be un-biased and use an objective decision making criteria when after hours of research I notice that there are more marketing material teaching Doctors how to dismiss my concerns than explaining the side effects.

Wulfman · Post by **Wulfman** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:20 pm

Beyond talking points wrote:Thank you for the link. I am a resourceful researcher; I will go through the tutorial.

From my point of view; a decision that will affect the next 60 to 70 years of my life is an emotional one. I am sorry if I offended somebody with my points of view, but it is hard to be un-biased and use an objective decision making criteria when after hours of research I notice that there are more marketing material teaching Doctors how to dismiss my concerns than explaining the side effects.

The "side effects" are better sleep, better health and longer life.......from more oxygen while we're breathing better in our sleep.

Den

cflame1 · Post by **cflame1** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:35 pm

Dude,
I started younger than you... and I still am younger than you. I have no qualms about using this the rest of my life... because I know that there will be the rest of my life, a lot longer than it would be without it.

My advice... quit the excuses and get going on the treatment. It's all in the matter of you deciding that it's going to work for you.

DottyG · Post by **DottyG** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:43 pm

OP, didn't you say you're 41? That's not that young to be diagnosed, you know! I was 42 (I'm 43 now). I agree with the previous poster - use the treatment. It does make a difference. I've only been wearing mine consistently for a few weeks (had some problems deciding I was going to do it). Don't make my mistake. I've missed out on feeling better until just recently. I regret waiting so long to start feeling better and preventing things like a heart attack, stroke and all the other potential problems.

SleepingUgly · Post by **SleepingUgly** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:24 pm

You know, all this jumping down his throat could cause a real obstruction.

His doctor said he doesn't even need the machine so the guy is not going to die or lose his mind before he gets the information he needs to weigh his options. He's competent to make treatment decisions for himself. The best way we can help is to provide him with unbiased information in a neutral, nonjudgmental manner. Attempting to scare him or chastise him into making the decision you think he should make won't work with someone who is as rational and level-headed as he appears to be. At worse it may cause him to leave and then not have access to the wonderful resource this forum is when he has more information and needs help making sense of it.

(I'm not sure why I am taking this so personally but I find his approach very rational, his lack of defensiveness despite repeated attacks very admirable, and I KNOW some of you by now and know you can help him if you would just put aside your emotions. I do recognize that some of you are aware of your knee-jerk affective response and are trying to be neutral...)

DottyG · Post by **DottyG** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:56 pm

I'm not saying he's not rational. I agree that he's incredibly so!

But, when I came here and tried to get the same answers and had the same reservations, these are the same responses I got. Heck, I figured it was just the way things work here! There ain't no pussyfootin' around when you ask questions about CPAPs here, I discovered!

SleepingUgly · Post by **SleepingUgly** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:11 pm

DottyG wrote:But, when I came here and tried to get the same answers and had the same reservations, these are the same responses I got. Heck, I figured it was just the way things work here! There ain't no pussyfootin' around when you ask questions about CPAPs here, I discovered!

It does seem to be so. The "2x4", as it's been called here, seems to come out frequently when someone doesn't immediately embrace CPAP therapy. What I find very interesting is that although there seems to be zero tolerance by some for not getting with the CPAP program, I have NEVER ever seen this sort of attitude here regarding weight loss. I have never seen someone berated for not actively trying to lose weight, but someone who is doesn't actively commit to CPAP therapy is often regarded as childish (this word as been used) or other pejorative terms. Am I right? If so, I wonder why that is. (And I am NOT saying anyone should be berated... I think I've been pretty clear how I feel about this, but I thought I'd better say that again.)

roster · Post by **roster** » Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:52 am

DottyG wrote: Heck, I figured it was just the way things work here! There ain't no pussyfootin' around when you ask questions about CPAPs here, I discovered!

I always thought that was one of the nice things about unmoderated forums - the members have their points of view and get straight to the point. It saves a lot of time and energy and the receivers of advice are perfectly free to accept, ignore or ridicule the advice.

Surely people coming in here are not surprised if they have any experience on the internet at all.

I would really like to start attacking everyone with a BMI over 29 but I have a fear that one of them might catch me and sit on me.

BlackSpinner · Post by **BlackSpinner** » Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:28 am

SleepingUgly wrote:
DottyG wrote:But, when I came here and tried to get the same answers and had the same reservations, these are the same responses I got. Heck, I figured it was just the way things work here! There ain't no pussyfootin' around when you ask questions about CPAPs here, I discovered!
It does seem to be so. The "2x4", as it's been called here, seems to come out frequently when someone doesn't immediately embrace CPAP therapy. What I find very interesting is that although there seems to be zero tolerance by some for not getting with the CPAP program, I have NEVER ever seen this sort of attitude here regarding weight loss. I have never seen someone berated for not actively trying to lose weight, but someone who is doesn't actively commit to CPAP therapy is often regarded as childish (this word as been used) or other pejorative terms. Am I right? If so, I wonder why that is. (And I am NOT saying anyone should be berated... I think I've been pretty clear how I feel about this, but I thought I'd better say that again.)

Cpap therapy is a breeze compared to weight loss. You shove it on your face, you go to sleep. No work required (other then keeping it clean). It is the simplest therapy available, it has very few negative side effects, no potential cancer, anal leakage, liver damage, kidney damage, zombie syndrome, or erectile dysfunction - in fact it is a boon to those who already have erectile dysfunction! There are plenty of other "poor little me" boards out there to enable bad cpap attitudes.

SleepingUgly · Post by **SleepingUgly** » Sun Apr 04, 2010 7:21 pm

BlackSpinner wrote:Cpap therapy is a breeze compared to weight loss.

I could not agree less, which is not the same thing as saying that I think losing weight is easy.

It is the simplest therapy available, it has very few negative side effects, no potential cancer, anal leakage, liver damage, kidney damage, zombie syndrome, or erectile dysfunction - in fact it is a boon to those who already have erectile dysfunction! There are plenty of other "poor little me" boards out there to enable bad cpap attitudes.

Anal leakage?! I had no idea Weight Watchers had so many negative side effects!

Mac33 · Post by **Mac33** » Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:02 pm

SleepingUgly wrote:
DottyG wrote:But, when I came here and tried to get the same answers and had the same reservations, these are the same responses I got. Heck, I figured it was just the way things work here! There ain't no pussyfootin' around when you ask questions about CPAPs here, I discovered!
It does seem to be so. The "2x4", as it's been called here, seems to come out frequently when someone doesn't immediately embrace CPAP therapy. What I find very interesting is that although there seems to be zero tolerance by some for not getting with the CPAP program, I have NEVER ever seen this sort of attitude here regarding weight loss. I have never seen someone berated for not actively trying to lose weight, but someone who is doesn't actively commit to CPAP therapy is often regarded as childish (this word as been used) or other pejorative terms. Am I right? If so, I wonder why that is. (And I am NOT saying anyone should be berated... I think I've been pretty clear how I feel about this, but I thought I'd better say that again.)

Hey a voice of reason. I got cursed out a few weeks back when I posted what one of my docs said that it won't kill you and it's become a cash cow to her colleagues rushing out to get certified. Then a week later the Israeli study came out which was also backed by German researchers that it extends lives in the elderly............ She never said not to use it or that it was quack medicine but be careful of the medical profession and do your own research just like this fellow is doing.............

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